POLL: Whether Houdini Is An Original Work?

General discussion about computer chess...

Whether Houdini Is An Original Work?

Yes
26
43%
No
34
57%
 
Total votes: 60

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Sean Evans
Posts: 173
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Real Name: Sean Evans

Re: POLL: Whether Houdini Is An Original Work?

Post by Sean Evans » Sat Aug 14, 2010 12:33 pm

Ovyron wrote:Yes, but I own Rybka legally, I oppose the release of such engines to ALL the people. I'm from the people that thinks it's unclear if the ip* engines are legitimate, if so, there is a risk they're just modified pirate Rybka (in the way they're being released).
Do you have any proof the the Ippo family is a Rybka clone/derivative? Vas has not provided any, to the best of my knowledge.

Cordially,

Sean

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Uly
Posts: 838
Joined: Thu Jun 10, 2010 5:33 am

Re: POLL: Whether Houdini Is An Original Work?

Post by Uly » Sat Aug 14, 2010 11:53 pm

Are you 100% certain that it's not a clone/derivative of Rybka?

Roger Brown
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Re: POLL: Whether Houdini Is An Original Work?

Post by Roger Brown » Sun Aug 15, 2010 11:15 am

Ovyron wrote:Are you 100% certain that it's not a clone/derivative of Rybka?

Hello Ovyron,

The proof of a negative is fraught with difficulty. For instance, no I am not sure 100% sure that it is not a Rybka clone? Therefore? Am I 100% sure that recently released super strong engine X (use any name here!) is not a Rybka clone? No. What next?

:-)

Surely it is far easier for the injured party - Vas in this case - to prove the positive, which would be the fact of the alleged cloning/copying.

In fact, his seemingly determined refusal so to do makes it difficult for me to continue to accept the continuous pointing of fingers at engines as clones, derivatives etc.

Five minutes from Vas could do infinitely more than all the discussions conducted here and elsewhere and yet....silence.

I am sure that someone as smart as Vas could expose these engines for what they are (if they are clones!) without surrendering any Rybka secrets.

Then again, isn't it Rybka secrets that have already been exposed that he would need to address?

Puzzling the silence....

Later.

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Uly
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Re: POLL: Whether Houdini Is An Original Work?

Post by Uly » Mon Aug 16, 2010 6:09 am

Well, I'm 100% sure that Stockfish or Critter are not Rybka clones, so certainty could be achieved.

If the rating lists started to test the supposed derivatives Vas would jump immediately to prove they're clones, he doesn't care because he deems the problem as solved.

Marek
Posts: 35
Joined: Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:16 am
Real Name: Marek Soszynski

Re: POLL: Whether Houdini Is An Original Work?

Post by Marek » Mon Aug 16, 2010 9:14 am

Ovyron wrote:If the rating lists started to test the supposed derivatives Vas would jump immediately to prove they're clones...
You think so? There's already this: http://inwoba.de/bayeselo.html And note too that when there was a hint of a legal challenge, Firebird was obligingly renamed Fire. Matters don't need to actually reach court before people reconsider their actions and positions - just in case. And yet, as far as I know, in all this time, no legal approach has been made to certain known authors.

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Uly
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Re: POLL: Whether Houdini Is An Original Work?

Post by Uly » Mon Aug 16, 2010 9:23 am

I don't think he's aware that list exists :mrgreen:

I think they only pay attention to 3 lists:

http://www.rybkachess.com/index.php?auswahl=Links

Peter C
Posts: 154
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Real Name: Peter C

Re: POLL: Whether Houdini Is An Original Work?

Post by Peter C » Tue Aug 17, 2010 10:12 pm

Ovyron wrote:I don't think he's aware that list exists :mrgreen:

I think they only pay attention to 3 lists:

http://www.rybkachess.com/index.php?auswahl=Links
That list has been getting more popular lately as AFAIK it's the only ponder-on list out there.

If Robert proves Houdini isn't based on Ippolit (like I want him to), CCRL, CEGT, etc will have no excuse not to test it.

Vas has to act (assuming Ippo* is illegal, which I really doubt).

Peter

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